MARINER 5HP 4 STROKE

Discussions related to outboard engines
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CHERRY PIE
Cruising
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm

MARINER 5HP 4 STROKE

Post by CHERRY PIE » Tue Jul 15, 2008 11:19 am

We purchased a mariner 5hp 4stroke engine 6 years ago and have been very pleased with it however all good things must come to an end, and our trusted engine met its end last Sunday afternoon. Symptoms began with the red warning light flashing so we stopped and checked the oil level which was alarmingly low...put some oil in no red light, set of again......few minutes later red light again...we limped back to our mooring pouring oil into the sump periodically. Back on the mooring I lifted the engine of the transom only to find oil pouring out of the leg! Back home we decided to explain the circumstances to our local outboard dealer and possibly have a deal for a new engine and part ex our old engine warts and all!. I got the news this morning....the sump of the engine had corroded away making it uneconomic to repair value £0. I can only think that laying the engine on its side on the floor in a fwd/aft position and the rocking motion of the boat has led to its premature end of service....the bottom of the sump is not really accessible...perhaps a generous squirt with some WD40 up the exhaust portal just under the head may help in the future? Perhaps an earlier trade in next time with the benefit of hindsight would be in order. Anyone else out there with the same engine you have been warned! Gary
Gary/Ruth & Skipper who used to sail a Swift 18

Puffin
Anchored
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2007 9:37 am
Location: Bristol

Suzuki DF4

Post by Puffin » Tue Jul 15, 2008 7:26 pm

Sorry to hear about the expiry of your trusty work horse. My old Two stroke Mariner also reached the end of its service and i decided to Opt for the Suzuki DF4 which i have to say i am very happy with. The DF5 and DF6 all have the same external measurments. but the DF4 seems to be up to the job also it comes with a 5 Year warrenty which helps.

giraffe
Making way
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 12:15 pm

Post by giraffe » Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:14 pm

gosh 6 years occasional use seems like a life cut short. Suzuki are on special offer at some suppliers at the moment eg ronhale marine 539 instead of 625
Martin
S313 "Aperitif"

CHERRY PIE
Cruising
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm

MARINER 5HP 4 STROKE

Post by CHERRY PIE » Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:18 pm

Thanks for the suggestions comments so far, I decided to bite the bullit and go in for same again (better the devil you know so to speak). I have placed a photo of the engine block in Cherry Pie's gallery, it clearly shows the hole in the bottom of the sump. Just a thought....does anyone think that chemical metal placed in the hole would repair the damage? The replacement engine albeit same make model has a different flywheel so my charging coil fitted to the sick engine will not transfer...never had much faith in it charging our battery anyway. I am going to have a look around for different options in order to keep our battery charged ie solar panels....wind vanes...hampster in a wheel etc... anyone got any ideas? Gary
Gary/Ruth & Skipper who used to sail a Swift 18

Terry
Cruising
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Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Gwynedd, North Wales

Post by Terry » Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:47 pm

Hi Gary,
I’ve had a 5w solar panel and an outboard charging coil on Seren for the past 4 years and the only time I’ve had a flat battery is once when I forgot to connect the solar panel and left my plotter on for a fortnight. My electrical demands are two 5w cabin lights, a clipper depth/log, fixed vhf, autohelm, gps plotter and nav lights. I only use the cabin lights to find stuff or passage planning and the autohelm, mostly, when the engine is running. I tend to have the gps, vhf and clipper duo on all the time unless I’m just messing about locally. The masthead nav lights are LED but the bow light is a standard 10w bulb but, so far, I’ve only needed to use them once. If my hands have been a bit wet I get a little tingle if I touch the panel’s connections!
By the way, I believe that although solid panels produce more power in direct sunlight the bendy ones (the type I have) have more output on dull days or in partial shadow and overall are more efficient. I don't know much about wind generators but I would have thought they would take up a lot of the limited space on a swift.

CHERRY PIE
Cruising
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm

Post by CHERRY PIE » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:34 pm

Hi Terry, Thanks for the info, we use our battery a little to much at night by having the TV on (our excuse is we watch the weather) I have seen a generator.. something that resembles a tin can whizzing around on a yacht rail that I liked the look of...had a quick look around the tinternet but can't find it. Solar panels seem ok I will have to decide output/cost etc. Nice to meet with Justin and his merry crew last w/e, we to thought about going to Puffin thank goodness we did'nt given the problems we encountered with the engine. Justin's idea of a get together at the mullbery sounds good, with a NW force 6/7 forcast for tomorrow this w/e is not good for us, Strong North Westerly's tip us out of bed! may get down for a sail on Sunday, Howsabout pencilling in a date for next Saturday evening at the mulberry say between 8 and 9 is that good for you? how about you Justin?
Gary/Ruth & Skipper who used to sail a Swift 18

giraffe
Making way
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 12:15 pm

Post by giraffe » Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:06 pm

I happened to be in Conwy today and saw Anna-Georgie looking good in the marina and I think Cherry Pie in the distance on the river.

Regarding recharging, another option might be a towed water driven generator. Seasure which manufacture all 3 options (no hamster wheel though) have some interesting comparisons in their website catalogue. For example sailing/motoring at 5 knots (or i guess moored in a 5 knot tide) gets you 2-4 amps from a water generator (and noiseless). It seems you'd need a lot of wind or sun to match that.

Just to quickly cross topics, I'm replacing some of the running rigging on Aperitif. The old sheets are 12mm on main and genoa, and look to be far too big in the mainsheet blocks which seem to be designed for about 8mm. What do people usually use on a swift please? 8, 10, 12...
Martin
S313 "Aperitif"

Terry
Cruising
Posts: 229
Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Gwynedd, North Wales

Post by Terry » Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:30 pm

Hi Gary & Ruth
Just in case you don't notice, I've sent you a private message.

CHERRY PIE
Cruising
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm

Post by CHERRY PIE » Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:18 am

Hi Martin, I think our main/genoa sheets are 12mm....would seem about right? The towed generator sounds interesting...partcularly low noise level, may be problematic to leave overboard through the week with low water and it touching the bottom or snagging on something....I found out what the tin can thing was....it was a forgen wind generator, saw it in pbo £339 v.expensive. We were'nt down Sunday I'll bet it was a bit on the rough side in the harbour!..Gary
Gary/Ruth & Skipper who used to sail a Swift 18

redtricky57
Run aground
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:53 pm

fixing the hole in your outboard

Post by redtricky57 » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:38 am

Hello Gary & Ruth
First of all let me introduce myself, I am Richard, I do not own a Swift but do sail a laser. I have seen Swifts at the coast and having once read PBO magazine they seem to be an excellent first step up from dinghy sailing.
I often read the Swift website forum with great interest and recently saw your entery and photos regarding your outboard and the hole in the sump.
Looking at the photo and being an engineer with experience of die casting it would seem to me that the hole is at the bottom of what is called a lightening pocket in the casting. Lightening pockets are there to save weight and material cost and it is possble that the casting may not have formed/cast propery in the first place and the material may have been thinner at the bottom of the pocket in that area to start with.
If the motor in general is good condition and it were mine I would certainly have a go at plugging up the hole
you mentioned chemical weld - The one that has been available for many years and used extesively by motor mechanics with good success is an american product called JD WELD (my late father was a mechanic and used it on cylinder heads to with good results
As with all repairs involving fillers cleanliness is paramount - so can I suggest you also try the following
1. clean the pocket back to bright shiney metal
2. if possible neutralize any corrosion that might still be left in the pores of the material with a chemical (maybe bathroom limescale cleaner)
3. as the pocket seems in the photos to have a perimeter wall - using a dremel with a dovetail cutter - cut an undercut all the way around in the side walls ( this will act as a key and if the vibration of the engine does looosen the filling if wont drop out)
4. if you can get to the inside of the casting clean this as well
5. do a test bonding onto a similar piece of casting if possible to get the mix right - examples - washing mc motor or car alternator end casting
6. make the mix and and fill the pocket (not sure how you will stop it going inside the engine unless you place some form of patch across the hole first - maybe expanded mesh aluminium of fibreglass matt
7. fill to top of perimeter walls making sure you work it into the undercuts you made in the sidewalls
8. when hardened off - file top surface smooth to tops of perimeter walls and paint with 2 or 3 thick coats of hammerite paint
job done
hope this works - sorry about the apparent lecture - be interested how you get on
Richard

CHERRY PIE
Cruising
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm

Post by CHERRY PIE » Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:40 am

Thanks Richard, I did use a chemical weld material to repair the hole in the sump, my preperations were similar to your suggestions, I made sure that all oil deposit was removed by scraping back to a good clean foundation....just below the sump on the bottom part of the engine is the original gasket which acted as a good support for the weld. I reassembled the engine, put some more oil in the sump placed it in a bin full of water, gave it a pull and it fired up first time and runs as well as it did before.
I was very pleased to receive your contribution as your thoughts fit in with my own in that the casting may have been imperfect in that area due to perhaps an airbubble? As I have now obtained another engine it is my intention to sell the repaired engine with an explanation of the repair, ebay seems to be the marketplace.
We used to trail camp and sail an enterprise sailing dinghy and decided fairly quickly that the time spent rigging the tent then rigging the dinghy was all a bit to much so went for the Swift 18 (just a bigger dinghy with a tent on the top so to speak) in order to sleep aboard when trailer sailing, then we decided again that its better to have it moored and thats what we have been doing for the last 16 years with no regrets. Thanks again for your comments. Gary and Ruth
Gary/Ruth & Skipper who used to sail a Swift 18

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